Goldman Interview for full time IB - what should I expect?
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Non-Target Rising Senior Seeking Resume Feedback
Hey Guys,
Rising senior here, just finished my SA in a MO role at a BB and received an offer to return upon graduation. Looking to move into IBD/Corporate Banking/ Big 4 TS for Full Time, I just updated my resume with this summer's expereince and would appreciate any input and feedback that guys have.
Thanks!
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FT Decision: Moelis vs Lazard
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Hard work and sacrifice will get you only so far
Mod Note (Andy): This post by @SSits is a comment originally posted in this thread "Karoshi": Death from Overwork on Wall Street" and I thought it deserved it's own spot on the frontpage
Yeah banking sucks in terms of work-life balance, but you don't succeed without hard work and sacrifice.
Good god, you Americans love your cliches.
A lot of people succeed without hard work or sacrifice, particularly people who are good at sales.
The people who are fixated on the false equation of "hard work + sacrifice = eventual success" in banking are typically the naive analysts and associates stuck on their hamster wheels.
Banking is a meritocracy, but often the definition of "merit" is not what your American myths of boot-strapping, hard work and sacrifice etc schooled you to think.
EDIT:
A major cause of burn out is when naive analysts and associates despair to themselves, "I'm working so hard, why is success not coming to me for my hard work and sacrifice, like the legends promised? DOES NOT COMPUTE!"
It's because your education system and surrounding myths of success convince you to think that if you work hard and sacrifice, you will certainly get to the top. "You go girl!" and all that Oprah Winfrey shit, or its male equivalent (eg "you don't succeed without hard work and sacrifice").
I see plenty of smart kids who aren't smart enough to think around their programming, smashing their heads into the wall of a stalling career, stumbling back, then smashing their heads against the wall again because they adamantly believe HARD WORK + SACRIFICE is the only key to success.
Hard work and sacrifice will get you only so far.
And often, there are faster alternatives to get to the same level of success (although that often means having a lot of natural talent and/or connections).
Dumb-arse persistent belief in high school mythology is not the only cause of career burn out, but it's certainly a big one.
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What are some good technical questions to ask?
I have a boutique informational interview coming up. Was just wondering what are some good knowledge demonstrating technicals questions that I can ask about the firm (to show that I'm not ignorant despite the fact that my resume is empty). I already have some, just wanted some better ones though.
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BAML - Investment bankers paid less and unsatisfied?
At the risk of getting some monkey shit thrown from other users, I would like to ask if the investment bankers at BAML paid significantly less than than the average and are less satisfied than the others? I have spoken to a few TMT bankers in the last 2-3 months and none of them seemed to be happy. I know banking is not a career for everyone. But even with this smaller sample size, BAMLTMT bankers seemed to be paid much less than other bankers (base + average bonus) at the associate level (1st year through 3rd year). They seemed to be making less than 200k on an average base+average bonus. Is that the case for 1st year banking associates across the industry or is it just BAML? Thanks.
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Degree for a good job in trading or IB?
Finance, CS, Economics, or any other degree. I think CS with a minor in Finance would be fine, but I believe that CS will be dead by the time of graduation as everyone is learning to code as fast as learning to walk. I am interested mostly in IB, trading, or even possibly working at a hedge fund. Possibly even Finance with a CS minor?
Much advice needed.
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BIG NEWS: 2014 WSO Compensation Report is OUT!
Dear WSO Community,
I'm pleased to announce the release of the 2014 WSO Compensation Report! We had another great year with even MORE entries than last year (over 5,000)! It took many months of hard work and finally, it's here ...and it's still free :-)
Yes, that's right, access to the FULL 155 page 2014 WSO Compensation Report is 100% free. (up from 108 pages last year). This report contains thousands of data points across investment banking, private equity, hedge funds and management consulting.
The report cuts the data numerous ways including division, city, AUM and company type and can help you know if you are getting paid enough. In the 2014 version, we even have data on target vs. non-target schools, race, GPA and major. Where else can you find interesting insights like that?
Or if you are an employer, this report will give you an idea of what range you should be paying your employees.
DOWNLOAD A FREE PREVIEW OF 2013 HERE TO GET AN IDEA OF WHAT IS INCLUDED
Here's how you get access to the full 155 page report:
The same as last year. All we ask from you is to take a few minutes to help us continue to build the most comprehensive and accurate database possible. After submitting three total entries (past entries count) to our Company Database (these entries can either be Company Reviews, Interview Insights* and/or Compensation Datapoints), your entries will be reviewed and you will be granted access to the report after 24 hours of submission (assuming we approve your additions).
Please DO NOT send me a private message or ask here if/when you can be given access unless:
1) you have submitted 3 entries and
2) 48 hours have passed from when you submitted your third entry and you still don't have access OR
3) you are a member of the media that would like to cover Wall Street Oasis and unique insights from the report (Patrick@wallstreetoasis.com)
Once you have access, you can go to the link at the top of this post and it will show the 2014 and 2013 reports as flash files. There are no hard copies sent out or e-mailed. Thank You..
Tutorial video:
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Middle Market
Recently, I had an interview at a middle market bank. The interview was very fit based. The MD'a discussed company culture extensively. I was called back for a second round with 3 other people. I have prepared for some technical questions. Any idea's of what to expect?
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Any way a sophomore can land a summer internship at a BB in NY?
Looking to break into the bank as a sophomore, likely wont be in IBD but something in the bank so my summer of year two can set me up to land the IBDsummer internship in year 3. Any advice ?
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Wall Street Prep vs. Training the Street
Hey guys,
Which of these two financial modeling courses is the better program?
I know that this site is biased since WSO partners with Wall Street Prep, but if anyone has used either I would like to know about your experience and if it was worth it.
Specifically I'm referring to the basic ($200) financial modeling course for each.
Thanks.
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Include my current job on resume when sending?
I interviewed with the hiring manager a couple months ago but I ended up taking an exploding offer because of time constraints and I started the new job 2 months ago. I saw that another opening on the same team was recently posted so I emailed him and he said it's still open. He asked me to send my updated resume to him and the recruiter (CC'ed). Do I include my current job where I've only been at for 2 months?
I told him about the other job when I was interviewing with him in the past and he gave me some advice but he might've forgot about it and I'm not sure how it'll look to have it included.
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Transferring colleges during senior year with offer
I currently attend a non-target and have an offer to BB. However due to financial reasons I might have to transfer to an instate school for the rest of my undergrad. It's undergrad business program is solid and MBA program is ranked in the top 25. My current school's MBA program is in the top 40.
If i were to notify my BB would they rescind my offer? I didn't summer at the firm.
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2015 Investment Banking Interview Prep Pack PLUS ...New updated version just released!
We are excited to announce a brand new new and improved 2015 investment banking interview Prep Pack, just in time for recruiting season!
As always, we keep improving our resources at least once a year to make sure we are staying on top of current trends. This version includes countless more investment banking related webinars in the WSO Video Library and thousands of more interview insights in the WSO Company Database...curious what's included in our new full "PLUS" package that can give you an edge?
...as always, if you are a previous customer, to get the new version free all you have to do is e-mail Ivy@wallstreetoasis.com and she'll send it your way :-)
Good luck this recruiting season!
Patrick Curtis
Chief Monkey & Founder, WallStreetOasis.com
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Morgan Stanley Bested by Goldman?
Goldman's name demands respect, obviously. But how has Morgan Stanley not achieved the same level of status? Does Morgan unanimously rank second due, only, to its PWM red-head stepchild?
Morgan Stanley Bank spots trends well beyond its competitors and funnels any of those scraps through its PWM via leftover new issues and flavors of the week (i.e. Clean Energy / non-rocket-launcher-producing Jihad SOEs). People have become disillusioned by the MS post-'07 "story"/business model. It is truly laughable to think of MS as being an I-bank perfectly balanced by its PWM business. Retail clients turn to MS for their investment accounts because it costs the same as E*Trade- oh, and you can tell your friend that your broker works at Morgan. James Gorman understood this when he saw how easily he could (and did) upend UBS with the acquisition of Smith Barney in '09.
Bottom line: MS shouldn't be second-rated by its very subsidiary MSWM.
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Hypothetical Offer Question
A hypothetical I am curious about!
Lets say I get an offer from a firm, I accept, sign it, but will start in a months time. During that 1 month, I get another offer from my dream bank.
Before I start my full time, can I reject? if so is their any consequences?
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Switching to IB associate role from another front office analyst role without MBA; possible?
Will be coming in as a senior analyst (lateral hire) at a top 10 bank in a non IB front office role (corp banking, s&t, cm), but was wondering if it's possible to enter an IB associate program in the same bank without having done an MBA? Has anyone seen this happen before?
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Thoughts on being an analyst at 25
Throwaway account - I am a first year associate in capital markets at a BB in a satellite office. Our firm hasn't been great at keeping salaries for the satellite offices on par with NY/SF etc, even after adjusting for COL - so I looked around and got a pretty good offer at a financial startup at a major city. My manager did not think leaving for a startup at this point in my career was a great idea, and moving geographies within divisions is difficult at our firm, so he made a couple phone calls and got me a position in IB coverage in NY.
The only issue is that the role is as a first year analyst.
At this point, I am 25 years old, three years out of college, and starting to get cold feet about whether I want to be an IB analyst. I can swallow my pride about giving up my associate title, what I'm worried about is whether it's worth it to spend another couple years in the grind as a junior in order to have a BB NY brand name on my resume and the potential for buy side recruiting/career progression in banking.
Compensation at the startup is pretty comparable to an IB Analyst in NY, lifestyle is much better, there is significant upside potential if the firm grows, and I am continuing to build on my skillset. On the other hand, if the startup fails, I don't have the brand name of a working at a BB in NY on my resume to fall back on and it may be more difficult to get my career started again.
The industry group is the same as what I cover currently in DCM, so I may learn a little faster, and I think I can handle the hours - I just don't know if it's worth the sacrifice to reset my career in IB or if I should just walk and go the startup route.
So my two questions are:
1) What is buy side recruiting like for analysts who are not straight out of college? is it a hindrance?
2) What is the perception of IB Analysts who are in their mid-to late twenties (Especially having worked in a different area of the IB)? Would that be viewed negatively by recruiters for corp/dev or other non-buy side roles?
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Bankers decide to take their talents to...Cleveland?
By now, I'm sure all of WSO is sick of the Wall Street vs. tech debate, but this article from Bloomberg is saying that bankers are not only leaving for tech but also smaller banks in cities like Cleveland.
Wall Street banks have been bleeding talent to hedge funds, buyout firms and technology companies. Now they're facing another predator: smaller lenders in states like Ohio and Rhode Island.
U.S. regional banks are luring executives from global rivals with an ease and frequency unseen before.About half the recruits for senior-level openings at mid-size banks are people whose resumes lead with names including Citigroup Inc. and JPMorganChase& Co., estimates Robert Voth, managing director in the financial services group at Russell Reynolds Associates, a recruiting firm. The share was about a fifth before 2008's credit crisis, he said.
In interviews, more than a dozen senior-level defectors cited a variety of reasons for moves in the past two years: the chance to influence big decisions without being overwhelmed by bureaucracy; the desire to play the hero in a turnaround; and better work-life balance. They joined firms such as Regions Financial Corp. in Birmingham, Alabama, and Fifth Third Bancorp in Cincinnati.
While I've never lived in cities like Birmingham or Cleveland, it does seem that bankers would be taking a loss in terms of the liveliness and "big city feel" of a New York City or a San Francisco while of course gaining the benefits of their respective cities. Also, it seems that while being a bigger fish in a smaller pond is great and all, these are bankers that have already established themselves in BB's, so it does seem that a junior stint at a BB might still be a desired path for some.
What do you guys think? If you were in a senior level position at a BB, would you go to a smaller bank to make a bigger "impact"? Would you guys be like 2014 LeBron and "come home" to Cleveland or would you guys take your talents else where?
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From Wake Forest to IB?
I'm considering going to Wake Forest for either a MA in Management or MS In Accounting. Will I be able to get into IB? Also, can one start from a small IB and land into a bigger one or do you generally stay where you're at?
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More Pages to Explore .....
